Jimmy Tarbuck, John Bishop, now the Kop.
I gather they do good ones about the Munich Air Crash and the Juventus fans killed at Heysel.
Those Liverpool scallies really do have the monopoly on wit and repartee!
Comment is about Let us bury the hatchet (blog)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
Fully agree with the sentiment, Ged. Likewise it's where I sit. Detested the woman (with good reason as I explained in my piece of prose), but equally detest the sight of folks dancing on her grave.
Poetically tight and well crafted with some vivid images.
Comment is about Ripples of Detriment (blog)
Original item by Ged Thompson
Well that's interesting. Maybe there's a lesson in that little story. People become a lot more interesting when they become less self absorbed or stop taking themselves too seriously.
Comment is about Jones the Voice (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
Thanks, Isobel. Interesting thing is that Tom Jones only became cool when his son took over his management. And dad had to be persuaded to sing "You're My Sex Bomb" rather than "I'm Your Sex Bomb" ... he didn't adjust to his new image overnight.
Comment is about Jones the Voice (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
Poetry and politics to one side for a moment, it's just so wrong that we should be footing the bill for the state funeral of a politician, when the rest of the country is being told to accept austerity measures. There's just no getting away from the unfairness of that.
Given the choice, I'm sure that nobody would have voted to spend 3 million on such a thing - even if they didn't despise her...
Comment is about Wordsworth's Ode to be read aloud at Thatcher's funeral (article)
Original item by Greg Freeman
tony sheridan
Sun 14th Apr 2013 18:51
Well said Andy! Take care, Tony.
Comment is about Goodbye Maggie Thatcher (blog)
Original item by Andy N
Newburry You do speak the truth- pitty its out your arse. Carry on.
Comment is about M.C. Newberry (poet profile)
Original item by M.C. Newberry
Sorry a.f.s she was responsible for the deaths of hundreds of members of the armed forces and misery enforced through her economic policies,did she stop and grieve for the deaths and misery? or did she carry on carrying on?- Tommy
Comment is about Let us bury the hatchet (blog)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
Hey TC - it strikes me that those who are gleefully hitting on "Ding Dong The Witch Is Dead" seem aptly unaware that it will be forever associated with posturing loud-mouthed midgets.
Ding Dong...carry on.
Comment is about Tommy Carroll (poet profile)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
One view is to see all that is great...look at Wordsworth's London. Another very different view of London at the time was provided by Blake.
Wordsworth didn't smell the shit or see the degredation - neither it seems did most of Thatcher's supporters when considering her time in office. To hear them speak of this time is to hear of a different world - one that I don't recognise.
The choice of poet seems appropriate...
Comment is about Wordsworth's Ode to be read aloud at Thatcher's funeral (article)
Original item by Greg Freeman
Did Thatcher request the poem herself? Or was it someone else?
I find the former very hard to believe. She never struck me as being anything but a total philistine, like most English lower middle-class people. Besides, wasn't her academic background in law and chemistry?
Comment is about Wordsworth's Ode to be read aloud at Thatcher's funeral (article)
Original item by Greg Freeman
Chris put me on to reading this and I'm so glad he did.
Its brilliant true and poignant, Its written from true emotion and is unapologetic in its venom towards the injustices done.
Its a very honest and well written piece, we all see differently and all fell differently and maybe there is no 'THE TRUTH' only our own truth. if we speak our own truth we cannot be faulted as long as we are true to ourselves.
You have illustrated your truth in the style of a very skilled and gifted poet.
Well done, much respect for you
Ged X
Comment is about Dear Margaret (blog)
Original item by Laura Taylor
I really like the line now Ged. Sense and end rhyme come together perfectly imo.
In terms of Laura's poem; If you search for Laura via the search box in the top left of the screen, you should be able to reach her profile. Her poem should be the last/top on her list of poems/blogs.
Best
Chris
Comment is about Ripples of Detriment (blog)
Original item by Ged Thompson
Hi Tom, Love the narrative style of this poem.I especially enjoyed the last stanza with the marrying of the cold and the hatching of a relationship; 'my mother and father were still skating around the possibilities of a life together' Nice one;great illustrations too
Comment is about Day 73 - Spring Was Late (blog)
Original item by Tom Harding
Great stuff Katy...says a lot without saying too much!
Comment is about Retreat (blog)
Original item by Katy Megan
Hi MC
Thank you once again for your advice and kind words. Much appreciated. Just glad you enjoyed reading.
Pete The Bus Driving Poet.
Comment is about M.C. Newberry (poet profile)
Original item by M.C. Newberry
do you mean this contribution?
I hope she became aware of her dying
I hope she became aware of her senility
I hope she died in pain
I hope she died in fear
Liverpool fans chanting When Maggie Thatcher Dies v Sunderland
http://youtu.be/37Cmzvt549Y
Liverpool fans pre-match away at Wigan 2013 Thatcher song
http://youtu.be/NtwavcblPzo
I hope she became aware of her dying
I hope she became aware of her senility
I hope she died in pain
I hope she died in fear
Comment is about M.C. Newberry (poet profile)
Original item by M.C. Newberry
Thanks very much boys, I'm made up with these comments (-:
Have adjusted on your guidance Chris, think its better now
Would love to see Laura's poem?
Have we got a link to it?
Comment is about Ripples of Detriment (blog)
Original item by Ged Thompson
Cheers for your comments John.
I wrote it quickly and just put it down as I felt it.
I've not done it that way before and don't know if it's 'poetry correct '.
Mike
Comment is about John Coopey (poet profile)
Original item by John Coopey
Good one, Michael - strong, brutally honest and well-structured. Gripped immediately, the reader follows you through the conversational dialogue and emotional actions. The repetition plays well to underscore the despair of the brief encounter.
Comment is about Spent (blog)
Original item by Noetic-fret!
It's interesting - from the title on. I presume a comparison of basic vegetation growth with life in general; except the first stanza is basically negative and the other too are seemingly positive. And I do like poetry based on scientific reality - a great genre to explore and develop. But I'm puzzled as to your point in 'Golden Fibs' which BTW, is a great title.
Comment is about Golden Fibs (blog)
Original item by Graham Ramsden
Does this contribute to a poetry site?
Comment is about Let us bury the hatchet (blog)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
Thank you for the comment Cynthia. I absolutely agree with you. It sometimes takes another eye to see it. I'm going to amend it accordingly and repost.
Comment is about Traces of you (blog)
Original item by Andy Ainsworth
It is good, I agree. IMO, with its capturing brevity, take out the word 'the' and the commas. 'From nights that punctuate' has a pushing-forward power diluted by 'from the nights that punctuate'. Small point, but worth considering; I found it a hard lesson myself - scrapping small words from prosy lines to poetry. And it doesn't always apply - just mostly.
And welcome to WOL. It's a great site.
Comment is about Traces of you (blog)
Original item by Andy Ainsworth
Epitaph for Thatcher's funeral.
If the Left cannot manage to be Right
Then the Right will always be Left.
Comment is about Wordsworth's Ode to be read aloud at Thatcher's funeral (article)
Original item by Greg Freeman
You are always worth reading - easy to follow with a cogent point to make.
Why not take out the 'Or' before 'If you're black or white or red'. IMO, it's a trip-up and really not needed.
Comment is about Citizen's Lament (blog)
Original item by Yvonne Brunton
Hello Pete - I go along with writing "off the cuff" as it were. Often too much thinking at the outset can interrupt the "flow". However, once the main body of the poem is set down, it is a good idea to go through it - and more than once - to see if some judicious "editing" might improve the odd word or line. Nothing wrong in that. The theme of "Shadows" is touching - and its execution is excellent. One of my recent favourites on this site.
Comment is about Pete Slater (poet profile)
Original item by Pete Slater
Are you psychic - that this poem just preceded Margaret Thatcher's death? And then it was open season on such poems. I enjoyed the military beat - could hear the bootfalls and the rattling drum.
Comment is about Entropy Song (blog)
Original item by Freda Davis
Chris - thank you for your considered comments on my post "Thatcher - In Passing" - both content and style. The "Sick Man Of Europe" tag remains with those of us old enough to know those times and the seemingly endless days of confrontation and strikes are still strong in the memory, with one industry after another slowly dying from within; and from without, as newly emerging economies offered competition we couldn't hope to match. We had to change, adapt or die. Go back a couple of centuries...to the glory days of our famous stage and mail coaches - eventually faced with oblivion as the various railway companies - with parliamentary backing - arrived to offer mass public transport. What, do you suppose, happened to the huge numbers of people reliant on the coaching trade? Was the PM of the day rubbished and were there efforts to bring the country to a stand still? Inevitably, as so often happens in progress, the mighty railways saw their own days numbered with the growing freedom of the private motor car and then the motorway. I ask - did they "destroy" this country or even parts of it - or were they necessary to secure the place of the country in the modern world? Ironically, the railways via the TSV/Eurostar, have since regained some new relevance/importance. Maybe, in time, our industries may also achieve some resurgence. What goes around, comes around. In the meantime, we should continue doing what we do best - invent, create, co-operate and sell! Cheers.
Comment is about Chris Co (poet profile)
Original item by Chris Co
Hya MC
Thank you for your obs on Shadows, noted about the rhyme. The problem is, I don't really think, I just write. When it's done ... it's done. Might have to start thinking though, hope it doesn't hurt TOO much. ;0)
Delightful is a delightful comment to make ... ta "Q" very much.
Cheers
Pete The Bus Driving Poet.
Comment is about M.C. Newberry (poet profile)
Original item by M.C. Newberry
Measured and considered, I admire the even-handed style that offers a view from both a personal and a general perspective - albeit essentially from a particular geographical(and political?) viewpoint. The adoption of "working class" as if it were a term solely descriptive of a certain employment and location may be challenged insofar there were many who also came within that remit but were supporters of the Lady and were trying in often lonelier less public/physical circumstances to make a future for themselves.
I'm sure this would be well received in performance.
Comment is about Ripples of Detriment (blog)
Original item by Ged Thompson
Delightful! This shows how the best comes from
things closest to genuine feeling.
On a point of rhyme - in view of the consistency elsewhere, I would have been tempted to avoid "as hard as you try" and gone
for something like "You can't catch those
shadows soon lost to sight".
But that's just me.
Comment is about SHADOWS. (blog)
Original item by Pete Slater
Hi Ged,
Some fantastic lines that hit the mark, not least;
Quote
When the lifeboat came unstable and you feared we’d all go down
You chucked us out, and looked on coldly, as the north began to drown
Unquote
My favourite is this;
Quote
So I’ll wish you Gods speed on your journey and pay you my respect
Show you working class compassion from a place that once you wrecked
Unquote
I like that for a number of reasons, the flow of the line and language is excellent, but also because it avoids being sanctimonious. There's no idea of superiority, rather in showing compassion, you afford her the one thing she never afforded you or anyone else from Liverpool, the North, Scotland, Wales, mining towns, steel towns, automotive workers, or those on their uppers. That's not mere humble pie. That is a juxtaposition that affords humanity whilst simultaneously highlighting precisely what she did - clever and intellectually satisfying to my mind.
To try and add something critical, to what is a very good piece of writing; I did notice one small technical point which might be worth addressing;
In the lines below, because of the number of syllables and scansion - I think the intended end rhyme of the second line in the couplet misses out;
Quote
Perhaps you thought it proper and in sound mind made your choices
Utilitarian motives maybe? Deafend you to the poorest voices
Unquote
I think this is easily corrected via a little play with the lines/language. Other than that I like the use of deafend and utilitarian in the context. Utilitarian is very appropriate because she definitely thought she was right and must therefore have counternenced acceptable losses. Deafened is right - becuase she couldn't listen to people.
In some respects your poem and Laura's poem on this are like bookends, similar in political outlook, but very different in how you have both viewed Thatcher.. Both are legitimate, powerful and personal.
I'll look forward to hearing you read this.
Best
Chris
Comment is about Ripples of Detriment (blog)
Original item by Ged Thompson
Kenneth Eaton-Dykes
Sat 13th Apr 2013 11:05
It's sad to see the negative`reaction to Maggies medicine and its side effects on the sick man of Europe.
It would have been (inevitably) administered sooner or later, by what ever party in power.
I saw one grateful ex Miner on TV recently
who is now a Nature Warden, saying, "It's the best thing that could have happened to me"
Comment is about THATCHER - IN PASSING (blog)
Original item by M.C. Newberry
I never used to like him till he re-invented himself and rocked with laughter. I think it was the Why Why Why Delilah legacy...
I remember seeing him at one of those 'party in the park' things in London and he was brill - knocked spots off everyone else. He has that stage presence that unifies an audience and makes them smile - a bit like Freddy Mercury.
Enjoyed the poem Greg - it's good to read something light for a change.
Comment is about Jones the Voice (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
Hya John
My grandkids have rejuvinated me, not that I really needed it but as you say .... happy days indeed.
Cheers
Pete The Bus Driving Poet.
Comment is about John Coopey (poet profile)
Original item by John Coopey
I would really like to hear this performed. The feeling I have is more of sadness and despondency than enjoyment - but that is becomes it evokes so much that came to signify the Thatcher years and her legacy.
Obviously I didn't know about the personal, but the personal links entirely to the universal, because so many people suffered in related ways.
Clearly it is a very powerful piece.
I have spoken recently about personally preferring to attack Thatcher and Thatcherism on a non personal basis. I have preferred to attack the damage of policies and legacy alone.
But I have great sympathy for people who feel they wish to go further due to how they have been affected. I have a respect for people - for each individual and their personal wish and need to speak in their own language and on there own terms.
For this reason
I agree with the sentiments of your poem. Understand and feel - yes this is right to say this, even if it wouldn't be the way that maybe I could express myself.
Well written.
Best
Chris
Comment is about Dear Margaret (blog)
Original item by Laura Taylor
I have not danced on her grave.
Though; If she thought about coming back, I'd park on it in my car.
Ok bad joke aside. We can hammer the policies and the legacy without remotely getting personal.
Here are two words people;
Augusto Pinochet.
Thatcher was a personal friend of the Military Junta leader. He visited the Thatchers each year, bringing Margaret as he did both chocolates and flowers. Of him she said he defended and represented democracy.
The connection and that last statement makes me physically sick;
For those that are not fully aware of the Pinochet regime - below I include the overwhelming evidence against him.
People need to read some of what went on here - bare in mind this was a close personal friend of Thatcher. It was Thatcher who helped Pinochet escape Spain's attempted extradition on human rights charges.
Don't skip the link below - read some of the extracts of what happened to people - read some of the suffering and then think on. She had dinner with him each year and were personal friends - what on earth does that say for her!!! ?
http://www.usip.org/files/resources/collections/truth_commissions/Chile90-Report/Chile90-Report.pdf
Another two words;
Pol Pot.
His Khmer Rouge - she supported it at one juncture. She was also against the Vietnamese invasion of the country that liberated millions from from being treated as cattle and saved maybe hundreds of thousands from their impending death. Pol Pot's regime having murdered a third of the entire Cambodian population.
Yet Thatcher is supposed to be a great stalwart and defender of democracy? Pleeease!
Another three words
Hillsborough cover-up.
I have read Sir Bernard Ingham's letter to a Liverpool fan. You can as well.
http://www.anorak.co.uk/353664/sports/margaret-thatcher-and-hillsborough-her-press-secretary-bernard-inghams-letter-to-a-disgusted-liverpool-fan.html/
Thatcher knew about the Police cover-up. She knew about that which is euphemistically referred to as 'police mistakes'. And her and her government deliberately conspired against the dead in order to deny natural justice.
Another two words;
Poll tax. Nuff said.
Socially she was disastrous.
Trickle down economics has proven to be an economic fallacy. Market reforms were needed and to some significant degree she got that right - but not at the speed and severity they were imposed which in effect resulted in a self created recession.
Industries that could have been put into managed decline- via funds from privatizations and north sea oil could have eased many people and communities into re-training. Instead entire communities perished, people spent lives sliding into hidden unemployment via incapacity benefit etc. The cure killed many of the patients! I don't think it does any good to talk of a cure if you were one of the people, the communities that ended up dead or of a wasted life.
She sought confrontation - she divided the country. It needn't have been that way.
The unions were at fault too, greatly. At least some of them were. But confrontation to the degree she employed only polarized them further, put people into trenches, made people more dogmatic. It guaranteed a mess - especially when any fool could see how dogmatic the likes of Scargill was.
People do forget all that unions won for the common man. People forget too easily and have replaced all the good with one image. An image from the 1970s of bins not being emptied, or of power cuts, or the shortened working week. But every common man and woman working to this day owe the unions a debt of gratitude. That debt is enormous and not up for debate (objective reality and a fact). We should not lose sight of that, just because of some militant idiots in the 70s and 80s.
Right now Thatcherism is alive and well, even if she is not.
Look at Michael Gove, look at what is happening to the teachers and see how they have been subjugated and limited. See how their ability to teach has and continues to be hampered. A lot of that goes back to Thatcher and the unions being broken.
It wasn't good for the unions to have been broken. Too much power was one thing and yes it needed to be limited.
But what we have been left with? The unions having no real power and the idea that the unions are that 70s/80s image in the mind of the public...that has really hurt the balance of power in industrial relations. It has placed too much power in the hands of government and big business. And the results are far from good. This in no small part is thanks to Margaret Thatcher.
Was she evil - no. She didn't need to be. She was a leader of conviction who didn't listen to others including her own cabinet.
When Thatcher got it wrong - she got it disastrously wrong.
No dance - no need. But really John? The idea, especially in these times, that one could vote conservative?
That would be far worse than any dance...
Comment is about Schadenfreude (blog)
Original item by John Coopey
Do you know Tommy - I've forgotten - but I think it was Ms Rachel Bond who read it out - so maybe she can fill you in. It was good - but I felt the message was a bit lost by trying to shock too much - they were probably looking for a reaction.
cheers
Ian
Comment is about Tommy Carroll (poet profile)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
Hi Ian- :o) what CRASS lyric was that please?
Comment is about Ian Whiteley (poet profile)
Original item by Ian Whiteley
at WOL in Wigan on Thursday - a young lady read out a CRASS lyric
just saying :-)
Ian
Comment is about Let us bury the hatchet (blog)
Original item by Tommy Carroll
BBC4 is such a great channel, particularly on Friday nights. Sir Tom Jones tonight ... duets from the 60s with Stevie Wonder, Janis Joplin, Little Richard, Jerry Lee Lewis. Wow!
Comment is about Jones the Voice (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
You're right, Greg. We enormously underestimated her. There is a halo effect (perhaps not quite the right phrase in her case) with Prime Ministers. Seldom do they look the part until they are in office. She was a classic example. She never looked like a threat to Heath - but was. She never looked to have any leadership qualities - but did. And I say all this with a deep dislike of the woman.
Comment is about The Winter Gardens (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
No, I've never attended a union conference, John. I was always editing the reports from them back in the office, a backroom boy. I thought 25% inflation was great; in three years in the late 70s my first mortgage more or less disappeared. I decided to re-post this to get on the bandwagon, and partly because it seems to be surprisingly neutral about Thatcher. My fb postings about her this week have been anything but. I think I'm trying to suggest in this poem that the left and the unions totally underestimated what she could do to them, and that was partly because of her gender.
Comment is about The Winter Gardens (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
A vivid walk down memory lane, Greg. Were you assigned to report there? I once manned a stand there with a set of oiks, one of which (the boss's son) asked me, "So what does TUC stand for?".
Inflation at 25%, interest rates at 15%, hocked up the the eyeballs at the IMF, the Social Contract in tatters, minority government. It could have been the Weimar Republic all over again. I reckon we got off light with Thatcher!
Comment is about The Winter Gardens (blog)
Original item by Greg Freeman
I was drawn to this, Mike, by its title.
"Moonlight and Roses" was my mother's favourite song although I never knew it until she died and my dad told me.
I really like some of the short lines and quick images - "aromatic smile" and "dance of rapport".
Comment is about Moonlight, Roses and You (blog)
Original item by Mike Hilton
My girls are 25 and 23, Pete.
But when I dream about them they're little again.
Happy days.
Comment is about SHADOWS. (blog)
Original item by Pete Slater
John Coopey
Sun 14th Apr 2013 22:22
Many thanks for your kind thoughts on my prose piece, Schadenfreude.
Comment is about Margaret Holbrook (poet profile)
Original item by Margaret Holbrook